From Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin) Fri Aug 30 20:21:00 1991 Path: aramis.rutgers.edu!rutgers!uwm.edu!rpi!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!csn!scicom!paranet!p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG!Michael.Corbin From: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin) Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors Subject: Pseudosurvey Message-ID: <74564.28BEF4EE@paranet.FIDONET.ORG> Date: 31 Aug 91 00:21:00 GMT Sender: ufgate@paranet.FIDONET.ORG (newsout1.26) Organization: FidoNet node 1:104/428.0 - From: jcj@tellab3.tellabs.com (jcj) > Date: 29 Aug 91 18:00:13 GMT > Organization: Hotel California > Message-ID: <7089@tellab5.tellabs.com> > Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors > Having been "lurking" for a few weeks, I would really like to > know how many of you people posting these "grays" articles > actually believe that there's a govt-ET conspiracy to stop > valid data on this sort of stuff. I don't mean to flame or > ridicule anyone, but you gotta admit some of this stuff is > way out there. > My background (if you care): Bachelors in Astro from > Northwestern U. (Yes, I knew Dr. Hynek). Agnostic about > the little guys... If you knew Hynek, then you have the answer to your "pseudosurvey." As you know, Hynek was a mouthpiece for the Air Force's Project Blue Book. His initial attitude was that only kooks and crackpots saw UFOs, which made him a perfect choice for the Air Force. However, after a few years of watching and debunking every report Hynek saw, he began to wonder about this whole situation. Obviously, not only kooks and crackpots were seeing and reporting UFOs, but so were credible civilian and military aircraft pilots. Actually, Hynek found that very little of the reports were generated by kooks and crackpots. Finally, the height of Hynek's mouthpiece years came to a close in the famous Michigan case where Hynek declared that a sighting by several credible witnesses was swamp gas. Following this, Hynek denounced his relationship with the Air Force and went on with then young Jacques Vallee to found the Center for UFO Studies in Illinois. In the early years, Hynek attributed the problem of no progress to absol ute naivity and stupidity on the part of the Air Force. He claimed that they were not scientists and were thusly not qualified to study this serious problem. However, as time went, and Hynek got more involved, he began to see that there was a coverup going on. ParaNet's director of research and investigation, Robert Klinn was a special investigator for Hynek. There was a case that occurred in Yucaipa, CA, where a tape recording was made of a UFO as it flew low over houses and a church. He personally p aid for the trip and research out of his own pocket and stated, "I'm going to make the Air Force eat this!" Until his death, Hynek was a big proponent of the reality of the phenomenon, and the coverup that ensued as a result of it. As far as the so-called reality of the "greys," I cannot comment on this, but I will say that whatever this phenomenon represents, there are more strange things involved than little aliens running around. Mike -- Michael Corbin - via FidoNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@p0.f428.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG From seawasp@pitt.edu (Ryk E Spoor) Tue Dec 3 11:59:23 1991 Path: aramis.rutgers.edu!rutgers!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!unix.cis.pitt.edu!seawasp From: seawasp@pitt.edu (Ryk E Spoor) Newsgroups: alt.alien.visitors Subject: Re: UFO's and UFO magazines Message-ID: <199496@unix.cis.pitt.edu> Date: 3 Dec 91 16:59:23 GMT References: <2157@faatcrl.UUCP> Sender: news@unix.cis.pitt.edu Organization: University of Pittsburgh Lines: 62 In article <2157@faatcrl.UUCP> cciolori@faatcrl.UUCP (cciolori) writes: (me) First, let me make clear that I do NOT agree (as I've shown previously) with the fuzzy new-age mysticism that often flies about thick and fast in this group. That said, I have to correct some wrong impressions here... > Why is it that the descriptions of most aliens seem to look > just like the fictional creatures in "Close Encounters" ? Wrong order, my friend. J. Allen Hynek was one of the advisors for CE3K, and Spielberg's alien designs were done from the drawings and descriptions of a large number of people; they represent one of the major classes of "aliens" seen by witnesses in Close Encounters of the Third Kind (the classification, not the movie; Hynek, in fact, was the one who invented the classification, where First Kind is that the object approaches you closely [~500 feet]; the Second Kind leaves physical signs of its arrival [burnt branches, landing pad marks, etc], and the Third Kind allows viewing of apparent occupants of the alleged craft.) And the description of "occupants" is not limited to the CE3K sort; those reported range from the Flatwoods Monster to Valee's "hairy dwarfs". And to some types not easily classifiable. > Why does every UFO sighting have to be part of some government > conspiracy? It doesn't. Though I admit that the babblings on this group could lead you to that conclusion. > How come the only people who ever see these alleged UFOs are > hick farmers that look like they are from the movie "Deliverance" ? They don't. I have seen a UFO. I know quite a few people who have seen them. Many of those who have seen Unidentified Flying Objects are well-respected, educated professionals. I PERSONALLY know of a trained Air Force weapons specialist, an Army Intelligence officer, a medical research scientist, a physicist, an astronomer, and other highly educated people who have seen UFOs. The number of UFO sightings in the US is in the multiple millions. Discounting the vast majority as mistakes or wishful thinking STILL leaves a HELL of a lot that were seen by trained, professional observers. I happen to be an amateur astronomer myself, as well as a technophile, so I KNOW that what I saw was neither any atmospheric or astronomical phenomenon, nor any device that could be built by any technology *I* have ever heard of. > Why does every allegedly abducted(via aliens) person say that the > creatures that took them away did medical experiments on them? They don't. That just seems to be the fashion in the fuzzy contactee groups. The first incidents of this were Barney and Betty Hill, I believe. Other contact-related activity has been reported many times, ranging from simple sign-language talking, to sexual activity (no, I don't believe that, but I'll add it as a reported action), to the besieging of a house. You seem to have garnered your knowledge of the UFO field by reading this group. Bad move. Try some of the better stuff in the field, especially J. Allen Hynek's _The UFO Experience_ and Jaques Vallee's _The Humanoids_. Sea Wasp /^\ ;;;