Info-ParaNet Newsletters Volume I Number 349 Friday, January 18th 1991 Today's Topics: Re: Couldn't resist Re: Paranet Newsletter 348 Re: Couldn't resist Re:Information new book Re: Couldn't resist Re: Eclipse CARP.UFO and GULF WAR ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Moderator's Note: I'm looking for these newsletters as they got lost from the archive. Number 20 67 112 118 320. If you have any of these, please send mail to 'cyrill@scicom.alphacdc.com' stating which you have. Thanks. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: pecan.cray.com!keith Subject: Re: Couldn't resist Date: 15 Jan 91 14:49:46 GMT From: keith@pecan.cray.com (Keith A. Fredericks) + Anyhow, aside from being founded on copious and pervasive + fundamental errors, dubious motivation, and an overall appeal to + prejudice, _otherwise_, Keith's posting was just great! Now that we all have the final judgement on the issue, we can all rest a little easier. Thanks Rick. -keith -- Keith Fredericks, Cray Research Inc., 655F Lone Oak Dr., Eagan, MN 55121 keith@cray.com (612)MUD-KITY Fax: (612)MUD-KLYX -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: aa440@cleveland.freenet.edu (Dale Wedge) Subject: Re: Paranet Newsletter 348 Date: 15 Jan 91 15:54:43 GMT From: aa440@cleveland.freenet.edu (Dale Wedge) In an article in ParaNet Newsletter 348, Dave Webb says: >What are you doing on the Spaur-Neff case? Both Rick Dell'Aquila and I (Co-SySops of the Cleveland Free-Net UFOlogy Sig) have had a long interest in this case since it so close to Cleveland, Ohio and our area of responsibility for the Mutual UFO Network (MUFON) for northeast Ohio. We thought that we would try and backtrack and piece as much information together as possible. Also, it will be 25 years since the incident in April of this year and that it might be an interesting article. >If you need it, I can provide you with some data from my files on >the case. Give me your mail address here on the net. Dave, it is Dale B. Wedge 126 Goredon Drive Chardon, Ohio 44024 216-285-9408 -- Dale B. Wedge-----(aa440)----(xx044)----Co-SySop----UFOlogy Sig \\\\\\\\WE DO NOT KNOW ENOUGH YET TO SAY WHAT THEY ARE///////// ////////SO WE MUST CONTINUE TO INVESTIGATE UNTIL WE DO\\\\\\\\\ -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: pecan.cray.com!keith Subject: Re: Couldn't resist Date: 15 Jan 91 18:18:13 GMT From: keith@pecan.cray.com (Keith A. Fredericks) Mike Corbin Writes: - Among your 'signal-to-noise' I have failed to see any substantive - refutation of the findings that were brought forth in Rick's - posting about the psychics. Rather than spend bandwidth on - personal observations, why not post something that can get a non-judgmental - discussion going pertaining to facts? It is obvious that - the predictions made did not prove out. That is factual. - So, what do you have in the way of refutation for this? Why do we need to refute? I didn't see any rule that says that you have to refute. Can't I just make an observation? Maybe we should break it down and see what per cent of postings deal in observation and what per cent deal in fact. In my opinion the piece about the predictions was presented in a very biased fashion. It made fun of, ridiculed, and condemned the line of thought that it is possible to gain information in other ways than via our normal sensory mechanisms. I think it is a real hoot sometimes to look at National Enquirer headlines too. One of my personal favorites was: Tap the Hidden Power of Ketchup And I would have fallen for it too, had it not been for the vigilant intervention of the skeptical organizations reminding me that the National Enquirer is not a reliable source of information. Rick would like us all to focus on the sitting ducks that he has cleverly and cunningly bagged at point-blank range with a bazooka. Nice job, Rick. It would really be far more enlightening and thought provoking (and probably more challenging for Rick) to see Rick Moen posting ``refutations'' of substantive publications. My major gripe is the editorial comment that accompanied the news release and the overall implication. The overall implication was that anyone who engages in the line of thought that precognition is possible is wrong. - Your posting about this being a judgmental list is - inaccurate. We are only exercising our freedom to post - results of something that was made public. Perhaps you - could also elaborate on how we are 'judgmental' in an - unfavorable way? Why should I elaborate on an idea that I have raised when you have already judged it as being inaccurate? What makes my idea inaccurate? -keith -- Keith Fredericks, Cray Research Inc., 655F Lone Oak Dr., Eagan, MN 55121 keith@cray.com (612)MUD-KITY Fax: (612)MUD-KLYX -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: John.Hicks@f29.n363.z1.FIDONET.ORG (John Hicks) Subject: new book Date: 15 Jan 91 16:24:02 GMT Tired of reading about the usual saucers and greys? Take a look at Ghosts of the Air, by Martin Caidin. It's about paranormal incidents which involve aircraft. Caidin goes from ghostly pilots through pilotless aircraft to a precendent for the famous Valentich disappearance. He also fires a delightful preemptive broadside at CSICOP. jbh -- John Hicks - via FidoNet node 1:310/8 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: John.Hicks@f29.n363.z1.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: pecan.cray.com!keith Subject: Re: Couldn't resist Date: 16 Jan 91 15:31:57 GMT From: keith@pecan.cray.com (Keith A. Fredericks) Rick Moen Writes: - Keith would no doubt criticise the National Geographic Society - for allegedly creating the implication that astronomy is not - worthy of study, since it never has articles on that subject. - He would say that carpenters imply that _only wood_ is worthy of - use in construction, because they don't use steel girders, that - physicists imply that chemistry is not worthy of scrutiny because - they don't do titrations, etc. Clever idea, but what I was referring to was the pivotal idea of skepticism that it is a ``healthy'' part of all science. This is probably the best argument for having a ``skeptics' movement,'' that is, to be ever vigilant in the quest for good science. This argument loses some momentum, however when we find that: - The purpose of the skeptics' movement _happens to be_ the - critical examination of fringe science/medicine and paranormal - claims (which doesn't entail 'belief' or "preaching", by the - way). That happens to just be a basic fact. That's what the - field _concerns_. It is ludicrous to suggest that it _must also_ - be the skeptics' business to cover every branch of mainstream - science. They have a vast enough territory to cover, as it is. You are telling us then that your ``job description'' is to focus on this one area of investigation. The implication is that you want to focus on this one area of investigation because you feel that there is more ``funny business'' going on in this area than in other areas of investigation. So, the skeptics' organizations are set up for much the same reasons as a commission might be set up to investigate allegations of organized crime. Except, since the skeptical organizations were not formed due to any official action of a scientific organization, the skeptics organizations are more like vigilante groups. As we all know, vigilante groups are prone to excesses such as the ``lynch-mob mentality,'' and should be avoided whenever possible. - Isn't it interesting that Keith didn't fault BAS's press release - for any _inaccuracies_? One might almost think that Keith regards - fact-determination as unimportant, that the key thing on Paranet - is that no one to be scared off by 'judgement' (which seems to - mean any attempt to distinguish fact from fiction). As far as I can tell, the fact-determination that you are talking about is the determination that these tabloid psychic predictions did not come true. I don't think that qualifies as being worthy of much attention at all unless you are interested in statements of the obvious. Try to choose issues of substance for your ``fact-determination.'' - Anyhow, aside from being founded on copious and pervasive - fundamental errors, dubious motivation, and an overall appeal to - prejudice, _otherwise_, Keith's posting was just great! It is true, flame-retardant underwear is not enough! I need waders. -keith -- Keith Fredericks, Cray Research Inc., 655F Lone Oak Dr., Eagan, MN 55121 keith@cray.com (612)MUD-KITY Fax: (612)MUD-KLYX -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Daniel.O'donnell@f222.n260.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Daniel O'donnell) Subject: Re: Eclipse Date: 14 Jan 91 22:58:01 GMT KL> I've been reading Sagan's latest snoring collection of KL> billions of adjectives..it's about nuclear winter. KL> It was mentioned in retort to me by a friend that even KL> a conventional war would have firestorms sufficient to KL> raise absorbing particulate matter. The parallel given KL> to support this was the cruel winters of WWII. KL> Petroleum "smoke" of an even more recent study was modeled KL> to simulate this effect of lowering the surface temps. KL> Something like 5-10 degrees was consider'd quite harmful What happens when you have a Nuclear Winter while you have Global Warming from the GreenHouse Effect? Does the whole planet become confused, and start wobbling? A schitzo planet... -- Daniel O'donnell - via FidoNet node 1:310/8 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: Daniel.O'donnell@f222.n260.z1.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: vm1.yorku.ca!YSCS1296 Subject: CARP.UFO and GULF WAR Date: 17 Jan 91 20:23:00 GMT From: User With the recent turn of events, can we focus a bit on the validity of what CARP.UFO may be telling us? I know I came across it quite a few months prior to the Kuwait invasion, but does anyone have the exact date of its release to the public? Was there, in the media, any information at all which could lead to the author 'predicting' the events in the middle-east? If not, then how closely do the world events correlate with the file's warnings? If Israel is invaded successfully by Hussein, are we to expect a Red Chinese retailation via biochemical warheads in the Artic? What exactly is the Red Chinese stance at this time? It seems they are unusually quiet. How do you view the involvement of the Stealth fighters in the air campaign? UFO technology, as we have been told? The aim of going to war due to oil is but a theory. What is the alternative theory? This war has been predicted to occur by many occult methods (psychic, astrological, religious, legendary, etc...) and I have heard that it wil last 30 years. That does not correlate with the A.D. 2000 scenario (where that year is the deadline for world-wide apocylapse/alien invasion) told by the Bible, and other such texts (of which Arabian scriptures are a big part). In my view, we are looking at more than a 'fog of war' coverup. There is more at work than technical fog, and the usual expected disinformation as a result of military strategy. Comments? ********To have your comments in the next issue, send electronic mail to******** 'infopara' at the following address: UUCP {ncar,isis,boulder}!scicom!infopara DOMAIN infopara@scicom.alphacdc.com ADMIN Address infopara-request@scicom.alphacdc.com {ncar,isis,boulder}!scicom!infopara-request ******************The**End**of**Info-ParaNet**Newsletter************************