Info-ParaNet Newsletters Volume I Number 378 Saturday, March 16th 1991 Today's Topics: Hatonn and the Pleiades Re: Relativity Woes (none) Interview Arui Linguists Arui Halley's Comet Forward/transporters ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: well.sf.ca.us!ddrasin Subject: Hatonn and the Pleiades Date: 15 Mar 91 18:20:57 GMT From: ddrasin@well.sf.ca.us (Dan Drasin) Just some quick replies to some points raised during the past few weeks: + Hatonn and the America West 'Phoenix Journals' I don't claim to be the world's foremost authority on this, but for what it's worth... Hatonn (Please, not 'Hatoon!') has been channeled for years by the Rock Creek Research group in Louisville, KY. This entity has never claimed to be Pleiadean, and has presented itself in a consistently respectful, humble and spiritually uplifting fashion. The 'Hatonn' presented in the America West 'Phoenix Journals' may in fact be either a crude fabrication or an 'astral impostor,' whose manner and 'vibe' seems diametrically opposed to that of the original 'Hatonn.' The journals give some justification for this (that people 'now have to be jogged out of their complacency') but it doesn't compute from a number of standpoints; too much to get into here. The Phoenix Journals are not likely to have been channeled, or received via a shortwave radio: While they admit that much of what they present has appeared elsewhere, much of it survives verbatim WITH TYPOGRAPHICAL AND GRAMMATICAL ERRORS INTACT. The violations of copyright alone (they are apparently being sued by more than one party) should be enough to raise a red flag or two: a spiritual teacher will almost never counsel violating the laws of the land. At any rate, the publishers openly solicit contributions of information from their readers, many of which apparently turn up as 'transmitted' material later on. The preponderance of the Phoenix Journal entitled 'SPACE-GATE: THE VEIL REMOVED' was taken word-for-word from papers by Bill Cooper and others. As of last year, several people named as supporting the Phoenix Journals have gone on public record as repudiating any connection or association with them, and I understand that Cooper himself is bringing suit. What useful information there may be in these journals (and there is undoubtedly some) seems strongly overbalanced by the amount of what appears to be mis-and dis-information mixed in helter-skelter, and above all by the simplistic and hysterical tone in which they are delivered. Information out of context is useless; information in *this* kind of context is *less* than useless because it strongly discourages intelligent people from taking it seriously. The only rationalization I can conceive of for presenting important information in this way is that its amateurish, ranting quality may prevent its being taken as a serious threat by 'the authorities.' However, if the publishers are to be believed, they are already under almost constant harrassment by the 'authorities' anyway. It has been my experience that groups that dwell on their own persecution (real or imagined) tend to have some serious emotional problems at the core. + Pleiades being 400 light-years away Distance is relative to the system of physics through which you perceive it. Current physics recognizes that conventional notions of space and time are transcended by demonstrable superluminal (faster-than-light) connections. The concept of a 'warp drive,' while certainly a long way from being realized, is not at odds with the picture of the universe that is presently unfolding at the leading edges of physics. Those who believe that 'what we know is all there is to know' should remember that powered flight was generally regarded as an impossiblity less than a century ago. Dan Drasin ddrasin@well -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: pluto@cs.ucsd.edu (Mark Plutowski) Subject: Re: Relativity Woes Date: 15 Mar 91 21:16:53 GMT This is regarding the recent message, included here: ----- Begin Included Message ----- +From: James Roger Black +Subject: Relativity Woes +Date: 14 Mar 91 14:27:17 GMT + +General Relativity, Einstein's magnum opus, may be in trouble, according +to the latest issue of Science News (9 March 91, p. 148). + +In a supercomputer simulation conducted by Stuart L. Shapiro and Saul A. +Teukolsky of Cornell University, the gravitational collapse of large, +nonspherical particle clouds in space resulted in the the formation of +what are known as 'naked singularities'--points of infinite mass and +density without a surrounding black hole to insulate them from the outside +universe. This violates the 'cosmic censorship' rule which states that +naked singularities cannot exist in the real world. + +This represents a potential disaster for general relativity, according +to Shapiro, because it results in a situation in which relativity theory +fails to model the physical world. + +'If cosmic censorship really goes out the window ... then one would need +to revise the mathematical equations for relativistic gravity,' Shapiro +says. + +For further information, see Shapiro and Teukolsky's article in the +25 February 91 issue of Physical Review Letters. + ----- End Included Message ----- My understanding is that it was more of a disaster for Roger Penrose's theory, which implied the connection between Einstein's theory and the cosmic censorship conjecture. Also, even if Penrose is correct, and the simulations do give an accurate model of reality, then (I gather from what I have read) researchers are still split on the impact of this evidence upon Einstein's theory. At worst, it seems it will only put a chink in a branch of it, and will not affect any fundamental aspects of the theory. -=-= M.E. Plutowski, pluto%cs@ucsd.edu UCSD, Computer Science and Engineering 0114 9500 Gilman Drive La Jolla, California 92093-0114 = -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ecn.purdue.edu!lush@scicom.AlphaCDC.COM Subject: (none) Date: 16 Mar 91 02:34:09 GMT From: lush@ecn.purdue.edu (Gregory B Lush) I was asked a couple questions about a previous posting. = +From Greg Lush (lush@ecn.purdue.edu) = +the scribe (I did NOT call her a channelor nor a psychic) has been = = Nor did you explain the difference, even when asked. Jim, I talked to a friend who introduced me to these Journals. He says that any definition he comes up with to describe channelling fully describes the interaction between Hatonn and the scribe. He felt that the reason that Hatonn made such a big point (note I said 'big' point, not "important" point) about this NOT being channelling is that he didn't want people associating this material with New Age material. I now understand that. I apologize for misleading you on that. My friend describes channelling as the bringing forth of information from other dimensions. Some channellors are better that others, and that ability would be a measure of how well the 'channelor' can focus on one frequency without allowing other frequencies to interfere or cloud. Hatonn criticizes others because they have let their ego get in the way and so they interpret the information and do not transcribe directly. He says that HIS scribe has not yet exhibited such faults. Of course, if one were trying to get people to buy ones books, it makes sense to say 'We are the only ones doing it right!' I don't know how to address that except to say you must decide for yourself. = +I heard Dan Rather quote Boris Yeltzin once as saying, = +'the KGB has beam weapons that can stop my heart.' = Can you give any reference for this quote? It's very interesting if true, = but it needs to be tracked down. (I have also heard [from an unidentified = source!] that the CIA can cancel out your brain waves. I don't consider it = technically possible, especially in the manner it was described [via a = 'bug' in a telephone receiver.]) Perhaps you could cause nervous system = effects with some sort of radio waves. I'm not a physicist, or a = biologist. But I suspect it would have to be very strong to work from any = sort of distance. I can only say that I heard that on CBS News in the last year and that it was before the Persian Gulf Thing. It had to be after I learned of this material which would be in June. I don't know if I tried to find a reference to it in the New York Times the following day or not. I do know that I heard it. Sorry for the haziness. The beam weapons the Pleidians describe use extremely low frequency 1-60 Hz waves. There are old studies now being made public and new studies being done which show relationships between EM fields from high- voltage cables and transfer stations and cancer and birth defects. There are two references to this that I can give you. The first is in IEEE Spectrum August 1990. It references a New Yorker 3-part series which was published 'a year before' June 1990. It is a long series which shows, among other things, that heart rates can be slowed in these fields. IEEE Spectrum: However, when the exposure pattern (of 60-Hz fields) is one of switching on and off every 15 seconds, alertness and reaction time worsened notably. Some individuals seemed much more sensitive than others. MRI (Midwest Research Institute) has also reported slight changes in the rate of heartbeat, with the degree of response again varying with the subject. The institute is now screening for sensitive subjects for further study. The IEEE Spectrum article also mentions how certain frequencies affect certain organs and frequencies nearby (they compare 55 and 60 Hz) will not affect the same organ. These phenomena seem very hard to study. These principles are the same as a beam weapon except less concentrated. Greg -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Michael.Corbin@f4.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin) Subject: Interview Date: 15 Mar 91 01:11:00 GMT > Hello All! I am doing a research paper on UFOs and am required to do > an interview. Any one interested please contact me via email. Welcome to ParaNet, John. Could you elaborate on your project a bit more? Perhaps we could help you find that someone. Michael Corbin Director -- Michael Corbin - via FidoNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@f4.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Michael.Corbin@f4.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Michael Corbin) Subject: Arui Date: 15 Mar 91 01:34:00 GMT > From: webb@afglsc.span.nasa.gov > With regard to the solar flare postings, what does this have to do with > UFOs? Periodic energetic flare outbursts are not uncommon, especially at > this phase of the solar cycle. Maybe you were worried about possible > outages of Paranet communications. Cross posted to the wrong conference by mistake. Sorry for the unnecessary bandwidth. Mike -- Michael Corbin - via FidoNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: Michael.Corbin@f4.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: ParaNet.Information.Service@f4.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG (sm) Subject: Linguists Date: 15 Mar 91 05:34:00 GMT ParaNet is in need of linguists who can volunteer their time to translate and transcribe foreign documents and articles. At the present time, we are in need of French and Italian linguists. Please reply via this conference or to one of the following addresses: ParaNet @ FidoNet 1:104/422 Paranet @ Internet - mcorbin@scicom.alphacdc.com Thank you. Michael Corbin Director -- ParaNet(sm) Information Service - via FidoNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: ParaNet(sm).Information.Service@f4.n104.z1.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: John.Burke@f9.n1012.z9.FIDONET.ORG (John Burke) Subject: Arui Date: 15 Mar 91 07:01:00 GMT Dave Webb writes: > > On a separate matter, I was intrigued by Roger Black's > reference in > Vallee's book 'Confrontations' to Behrendt's paper. What > the hey is "Annals > of Ufological Research Advances' ?!! Has anyone ever heard > of this obscure > publication? Is it an English-language periodical? > > Dave Webb Dave: Ken Behrendt's A.U.R.A. is a 12-page newsletter which he publishes out of Florida. Single issues are available from Arcturus Books at $5 each. It seems to be concerned with the reverse-engineering of UFOs, based on whatever can be gleaned from documented observations. -- John -- John Burke - via FidoNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: John.Burke@f9.n1012.z9.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Kurt.Lochner@f22.n14766.z1.FIDONET.ORG (Kurt Lochner) Subject: Halley's Comet Date: 10 Mar 91 19:42:31 GMT > I am curious among our scientific users if this > phenomena related to Halley's Comet in the previous > post is a normal feature of a comet? > No, not considering that the ejection would have been much more likely with closer proximity to the Sun. It usually takes tremendous heat input for a system of frozen liquids surrounding a rocky core to become super-heated enough to cause clouds/ejected materials. What might have provided the path for this gaseous escape/ejecta could have been the weakening or fracture of the frozen outer shell of this comet, perhaps due to gravitational stress or collision with an asteriod. Past this, I would only be guessing at the distances and forces involved, none of which have been mentioned. -- Kurt Lochner - via FidoNet node 1:104/422 UUCP: !scicom!paranet!User_Name INTERNET: Kurt.Lochner@f22.n14766.z1.FIDONET.ORG -------------------------------------------------------------------- From: violet.berkeley.edu!chalmers Subject: Forward/transporters Date: 16 Mar 91 10:57:44 GMT From: chalmers@violet.berkeley.edu (John H. Chalmers Jr.) Clark: Good to hear from you again. Although I logon every morning, I haven't posted much recently as the topics have been ones about which I have little insight or knowledge. Forward is a straight General Relativitist as far as I know. At one time he made a generous offer to do the tensor computations for other SF authors using GR/SR in their stories. As for the recent Naked Singularity computation, I'd like to see how the story develops in the next few months as other theorists check the assumptions and results. I've appended a computation I did on the bandwidth requirements for a matter transmitter. Somebody pointed out that I should double my numbers to include the 3 components of momentum (as well as space), but what's a factor of 2 in 10 exp 30 or 45? Also, I haven't the faintest idea how a scanner could measure velocity. The question recently was raised about 3D scanning, presumably for matter transmission, i.e., the Star Trek Transporter. The idea intrigued me as I remembered a statement by Arthur C. Clarke in talk given years ago at UC, Berkeley that the bandwidth would be prohibitively high. So,I decided to try to estimate it. Let us assume we want to transport a human being weighing 60 kilos (about 132 lbs, rather average). Humans are mostly water and as a first approximation, let's assume humans are 100% water so we can more easily calculate the number of atoms in 60 kg's of flesh. Water has a MW of 18 (O +2 H) so there are 1000/18 moles of water per kilo. There are 6.023 x10 exp 23 molecules per mole (Avogadro's number); ergo there are 60 x 1000/18 x 6.023 x 3 atoms in a 60 kg human body. This number is 6.023 x 10 exp 27 atoms. Identifying each one in a real body as to atomic number and isotope would require 8 bits. This means we need 8 x 6.023 x 10 exp 27 or 4.818 x 10 exp 28 bits just to enumerate the atoms. In order not to break chemical bonds and destroy DNA, proteins, etc. or create reactive fragments, we need to know the location of each atom to picometer resolution (chemical bonds are typically 100's of pm) in 3D dimensions. It takes 40 bits (2 exp 40) to express 10 exp12. Therefore we need 3 x 40 x 4.818 x 10 exp 28 bits of information to locate every atom in a body. This number is 5.782 x 10 exp 30 bits. However, these atoms are not static, many are taking part in chemical reactions. Chemical reactions occur on time scales of tens of femtoseconds ( the much slower observed rates are due to diffusion, fraction with enough energy to react at given temperatures, etc.). Therefore to correctly determine all the chemical species, we need to scan the body in 10 exp -15 seconds, which yields a bandwidth of 5.782 x 10 exp 45 bits/sec as a worst case estimation. One might improve on this number my assuming that the small fraction of atoms actually undergoing chemical change at any instant is irrelevant or one might freeze the body to near absolute zero to stop chemical reactions, diffusion, circulation, etc. In these cases, one might gain 15 or 20 orders of magnitude in the bandwidth requirements, if long scan times are acceptable. The small percent of heavier elements in the body would make a minor adjustment to the bandwidth. Data compression schemes might be of value in some cases; a boule of isotopically pure semiconductor grade silicon would have no dislocations, so not much info other than the dimensions might have to be sent. How would one actually do the scanning? I have no idea NMR imaging only works for those atoms having magnetic moments and currently has a resolution of millimeters, so it would have to be improved by a factor of a billion. Perhaps another method can be discovered, or teleportation might be limited to atoms with net spins. Also, storing and transmitting this amount of data boggles my mind. --- John ********To have your comments in the next issue, send electronic mail to******** 'infopara' at the following address: UUCP {ncar,isis,boulder}!scicom!infopara DOMAIN infopara@scicom.alphacdc.com ADMIN Address infopara-request@scicom.alphacdc.com {ncar,isis,boulder}!scicom!infopara-request ******************The**End**of**Info-ParaNet**Newsletter************************